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Talk:Daphne Guinness

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I will add references and further information. — Jonathan Bowen 14:28, 21 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It says in the intro that she is an heiress to the Guinness family, that in itself is notable.--Alf melmac 14:32, 21 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

So Solid

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Final paragraph of personal life is obviously untrue. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.4.111.54 (talk) 14:36, 9 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Tone

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This article is ridiculously hagiographic. As far as I can tell, Guinness is a socialite who funds some art projects through her immense inherited wealth and rich friends. The article needs to be a bit clearer on her actual notability within these art circles. Ashmoo (talk) 10:18, 4 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Request Edits April 2022

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Hello, I have a suggestion for an update to this article. As I have a conflict of interest as someone who works for the subject of the article, I am proposing edits here for independent reviewers to decide whether to publish my suggestions.

In the first sentence of the article lead, I propose replacing the term “socialite” with “musician and fashion designer”.

The new sentence would read:

Daphne Diana Joan Susanna Guinness (born 9 November 1967) is an English[1] musician[2] and fashion designer.[3]

Reason: Regarding the removal of the word “socialite”, as MOS:LEAD says, significant information should not appear in the lead if it is not covered in the remainder of the article. There is no mention in the article describing Guinness as a socialite. Wikipedia’s entry on the terms says: “A socialite generally spends a significant amount of time attending various fashionable social gatherings, instead of having traditional employment.’[4][5][6]

Using the term “socialite” as Guinness’ first and primary identifier as a person is especially inappropriate given her substantial career in music and fashion. For this to be the primary description of who she is as a person, substantial content about her being a “socialite” would need to be in the body of the article. And she would have to not have other substantial, traditional employment - being a musician, fashion designer and model is traditional employment. The fact that Guinness’ father was a Baron does not make her a socialite by default.

Thank you for considering this proposal. YhSA99b3tTnCnLdr (talk) 17:24, 18 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: This kind of title is based on what the available citations say about a person. Here are some articles I found that call her a "socialite":
https://www.vogue.co.uk/article/daphne-guinness-biography
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/daphne-guinness-the-socialite-manifesto-m5nvt8g6lk6
https://jezebel.com/field-guide-daphne-guinness-and-her-thoughts-on-hitler-5842607
https://www.heraldweekly.com/it-girl-the-whos-who-of-each-and-every-decade/44/?xcmg=1
However, I will let someone more experienced than me decide if this edit should be made or not. Edhaves (talk) 08:24, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
 Partly done: Taking careful consideration of @Edhaves: comment, pondering and working on the page for a few hours, I removed the word socialite, but I didn't use the wording suggested by the COI editor. Although reliable sources does state she is a socialite, people in the kind of professions of Guinness are notably famous for their social life and events.
Therefore it might be redundant to call all or most of them socialites. I then instead added her occupations. This is not in any way a final ruling. Articles generally are very fluid and someone else might reinstate the word if they disagree with me. Cheers! Thinker78 (talk) 04:27, 8 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Mead, Rebecca (19 September 2011). "Precarious Beauty". Retrieved 17 May 2019 – via www.newyorker.com.
  2. ^ Schneier, Matthew (25 May 2016). "For Daphne Guinness, the World Is a Stage. So She Picked Up a Mike". The New York Times. Retrieved 6 March 2022.
  3. ^ Guinness, Daphne (1 July 2011). "Daphne Guinness on the Unveiling of her Collaboration with Shaun Leane". Vogue. Retrieved 10 March 2022.
  4. ^ "Socialite definition". Reverso Dictionary. Retrieved 2010-10-28.
  5. ^ "Socialite". Merriam-Webster Online. Retrieved 2010-10-28.
  6. ^ Biressi, Anita; Nunn, Heather (23 Apr 2013). Class and Contemporary British Culture. Palgrave Macmillan.

Request Edits for February 2023

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Hello. I have a few more suggestions for updates to this article – this time focusing on the Fashion section, which is what Guinness is best known for. COI disclosure above.

@Thinker78: I believe you left a tag saying this section needed to be expanded, so this will help with that. @Thriley: since you’ve done substantive work on this article in the past few months reviewing other requests, I thought you might want to take a look at these too. Thank you.

1.

In the Fashion section, as the new first paragraph, please add:

Guinness’s personal style has been widely covered in the media, including Vogue,[1] W Magazine,[2] Harper’s Bazaar[3] and the New York Times.[4] Guinness was called a “street style icon, producer, musician, and muse of Alexander McQueen and Karl Lagerfeld” by Vogue.[5]

Reason: Adds context about Guinness’s high profile in the fashion industry, supported by coverage from a string of high-quality reliable sources. I suggest putting this at the top of the Fashion section to lead into the next section below, which goes into more detail about her work and influence in fashion.

I partly implemented your proposal. Instead of namedropping I suggest you write what media have to say about Guinness (i.e., don't write "she has been covered by x, y, z" but "x has said this", and "y has said that"). Best regards, --Johannes (Talk) (Contribs) (Articles) 17:10, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

2.

As the new second and third paragraphs of the Fashion section, please add:

She has been described as a “performance artist” by the New York Times for her use of and experimentation with fashion.[4] She was named to the International Best Dressed List Hall of Fame in 1994.[6][7] Guinness has styled photo shoots for photographers Steven Klein and David LaChappelle.[2]


Reason: A direct quote from Vogue seems to be a better choice for describing Guinness’ wide influence in fashion since elements of it are subjective. But the description is also highly relevant to her biography. I also propose moving up the sentence about her being on the International Best Dressed list, and correcting it to state that she was on the list in 1994, not “since 1994” - the Vanity Fair source does not say that. Adds information about her work as a stylist for notable photographers, with reliable supporting source.

 Done

3.

In the Fashion section, can you replace the current first paragraph that reads:

Guinness's first work in fashion was with Isabella Blow.[8] She has worked with Karl Lagerfeld,[9] NARS, MAC, Akris, Gareth Pugh,[10] and Philip Treacy, working with them artistically or as a model or both.

With:

Guinness has been a fashion model,[11] a curator,[8] and fashion writer.[12]

She has appeared on the covers of multiple international editions of Vogue,[11][13] Harper’s Bazaar,[14] Tatler, Zoo Magazine, and other fashion magazines.[15][16]

Reason: Removes the reference that Guinness’s first work in fashion was with Isabella Blow - it’s not what the source says. Specifies that Guinness has worked in fashion as a muse, model and curator of fashion exhibitions. Replaces Beaute Buzz citation with NPR, Financial Times, Vogue and the New Yorker. Organizes and lists her magazine covers, with reliable sourcing (for example, replaces Perez Hilton citation for Zoo Magazine mention).Reorganized and rewritten for structure.

 Done

4.

In the Fashion section, after the paragraphs noted above, can you add a new paragraph that reads:


Following a divorce in 1999, Guinness became more involved in the avant-garde fashion movement,[8] establishing relationships within the fashion industry.[17] Guinness was a close friend of the late fashion designer Alexander McQueen[8][18] and, according to Vogue, she “nurtured” his career.[1]

Reason: Adds information about Guinness’ involvement in the fashion industry, including important friendship with McQueen, with top-tier reliable references.

 Done

5.

In the Fashion section, after the paragraph noted above, can you add a new paragraph that reads:


Guinness has written numerous pieces on the topic of fashion,[12] including columns published in Vogue,[19]the Financial Times,[20] The Times of London,[21] and Harper’s Bazaar.[22][23] She also wrote the foreword to Alexander McQueen: Fashion Visionary,[24] contributed to Dressed to Kill: Jazz Age Fashion,[25] and co-authored Art/Fashion in the 21st Century.[26]


Reason: Adds information about Guinness’ work as a fashion editor, author and contributor with high quality sourcing.

 Done

6.

In the Fashion section, please add new paragraphs:

In 2004, she was brought on as a fashion consultant for Gucci by François-Henri Pinault.[27]

Following Isabella Blow’s death in 2007, Guinness purchased her entire fashion collection, months before it was scheduled to be auctioned by Christie’s in 2010.[28] In 2014, Guinness exhibited more than 100 pieces of Blow’s collection at Somerset House.[1]

She curated an exhibition at the Fashion Institute of Technology in 2011 that featured more than 100 contemporary pieces by various designers, including Alexander McQueen, Chanel, Valentino, and others, all from her personal couture collection.[8] The exhibit also featured The Phenomenology of Body, a short film Guinness directed focused on costumes through the ages.[11]

As a tribute to the deaths of Isabella Blow and Alexander McQueen, in 2011 Guinness dressed in public for the Met Gala in a Barney’s window; she wore a feathered McQueen dress and other pieces from Blow’s collection.[29]

 Done

Reason: Adds more information about Guinness’s work as a fashion consultant, curator of fashion exhibitions, and as a fashion film director, with reliable sourcing. Provides details about the exhibits she’s curated, which received international press coverage, with supporting reliable sources. Includes Guinness’s tribute to McQueen and Blow, with strong supporting citations.

7.

Please remove the paragraph in the Fashion section that reads:

She was a friend of the late fashion designer Alexander McQueen.[30] Scheduled to model for charity on the runway the day his suicide was announced, Guinness veiled herself in mourning.[31]


Reason: Guinness’ relationship with McQueen was moved up to earlier in the Fashion section, with updated, reliable sourcing (i.e. removed Huffington Post). The “Stylelist” citation in the next sentence does not reference Guinness “veling herself in mourning” at a charity show, so this is incorrect.

 Done

8.

Please replace the third paragraph in the Fashion section that reads: She designs clothes, jewelry, and perfume.[32] Since 1994, she has been on the International Best Dressed List.[33] In 2010, she was named in Tatler's top 10 best-dressed list.[citation needed] In 2011, she created a make-up line for MAC cosmetics.[34][35]

With:

As a designer, Guinness has designed a collection of shirts with Comme des Garçons for Dover Street Market,[2][36] and created an estimated 100 pieces for herself in 2010 alone with no intention of selling them.[3][37] She designed Contra Mundum, an 18-carat white gold glove encrusted with diamonds, with British jeweler Shaun Leane and Alexander McQueen.[1][38] The glove was worn in McQueen’s shows, and was auctioned at Sotheby’s in 2017.[39]

Reason: Overall rewrites and organizes for structure. Replaces missing or invalid citations, like the Zimbio link and primary, broken links (like the ones used when talking about MAC). Adds more information about cosmetic collaborations and design work, with reliable sourcing. Moves best-dressed sentence to earlier in the section (see request #1.)

 Done

9. In the Fashion section, after the paragraph above, please add a new paragraph:

In 2009, she created a scent named Daphne for Comme des Garçons.[2] Guinness collaborated with NARS Cosmetics as the model for the fall 2010 campaign, which included an eyeshadow named after her.[3][40] In 2011, she released a 21-product makeup line with MAC Cosmetics that included blushes, lipsticks and nail polishes.[41]

Reason: Adds new details about Guinness’ collaborations and work with notable fashion brands, with reliable supporting sources.

 Done

10.

Please remove the fourth paragraph in the Fashion section that reads: In 2011 Guinness was photographed by photographer Bryan Adams and featured on the cover of Zoo Magazine.[42]

Reason: I already proposed moving Guinness’s magazine covers to request #1, to help better organize this section. In request #1, replaced Perez Hilton as a source, since that is not considered reliable.

 Done

Thanks. YhSA99b3tTnCnLdr (talk) 15:20, 8 February 2023 (UTC) YhSA99b3tTnCnLdr (talk) 15:20, 8 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@YhSA99b3tTnCnLdr there is a very long queue for conflict of interest edit requests. I suggest you consider reforming your request according to WP:MAKINGEREQ. Regards, Thinker78 (talk) 22:15, 8 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Hello, I have made most of the requested edits. Please have a look and let me know wheter you'd like to see additional amendments. Best regards, --Johannes (Talk) (Contribs) (Articles) 17:22, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ a b c d Cary, Alice (14 August 2020). "From McQueen Corsets to Armadillo Shoes, Daphne Guinness Reflects On 18 Years Of Her Avant-Garde Style". Vogue. Retrieved 5 March 2022.
  2. ^ a b c d Reginato, James (2 February 2009). "Daphne Guinness: Rare Bird". W Magazine. Retrieved 23 September 2022.
  3. ^ a b c Blasberg, Derek (11 February 2011). "The Real Daphne Guinness". Harper's Bazaar. p. 2. Retrieved 18 January 2018.
  4. ^ a b Trebay, Guy (30 December 2010). "Daphne Guinness, Fashion's Wild Child". The New York Times. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  5. ^ Allaire, Christian (18 October 2020). "Daphne Guinness On Bringing Her Surreal Style to TikTok". Vogue. Retrieved 26 October 2022.
  6. ^ Horyn, Cathy (3 August 2012). "Search On the Runway SEARCH Eunice Johnson and the Best Dressed List". The New York Times. Retrieved 1 November 2022.
  7. ^ "The International Best-Dressed List Hall of Fame: Women". Style. Vanity Fair. 11 July 2011. Retrieved 8 August 2012.
  8. ^ a b c d e Lyden, Jacki (13 November 2011). "Daphne Guinness: An Icon on Fashion's Cutting Edge". National Public Radio. Retrieved 5 April 2013. Cite error: The named reference "NPRJackiLyden" was defined multiple times with different content (see the help page).
  9. ^ "I am convinced that Daphne Guinness and Karl Lagerfeld are the same person". The Beat Buzz. 29 January 2011. Retrieved 16 April 2013.
  10. ^ West, Hattie (30 November 2011). "Vanishing Act". Vogue Magazine. Retrieved 16 April 2013.
  11. ^ a b c Mead, Rebecca (19 September 2011). "Precarious Beauty". The New Yorker. Retrieved 12 October 2022.
  12. ^ a b Solowij, Anne-Marie (5 Sep 2009). "There's a fungus in my fragrance". Financial Times. Retrieved 13 October 2022.
  13. ^ Staff (5 September 2008). "Daphne Guinness, Vogue Italia Cover Girl". NBC New York. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  14. ^ Makkas, Chrissy (18 November 2011). "Daphne Guinness Rocks the Cover of Harper's Bazaar Russia". The Fashion Spot. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  15. ^ Staff (30 November 2010). "Daphne Guinness for Zoo Magazine". Design Scene. Retrieved 12 October 2022.
  16. ^ Dunbar, Hawley (8 March 2012). "Daphne Guinness For Hong Kong Tatler". Sidewalk Hustle. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  17. ^ Abad, Mario (26 March 2020). "The Apocalyptic World of Daphne Guinness". Paper. Retrieved 7 March 2022.
  18. ^ Cochrane, Lauren (15 July 2020). "Daphne Guinness: 'I stood almost naked for six hours, being splashed with water'". The Guardian. Retrieved 12 October 2022.
  19. ^ Guinness, Daphne (4 May 2011). "Remembrance of Things Past: Daphne Guinness on Alexander McQueen and Isabella Blow Behind the Windows at Barneys". Vogue. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  20. ^ Guinness, Daphne (17 May 2012). "Dress to impress". Financial Times. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  21. ^ Guinness, Daphne (13 June 2021). "Wearing L'Wren's clothes made me feel invincible". The Times. Retrieved 7 October 2022.
  22. ^ Guinness, Daphne (4 May 2011). "Remembrance of Things Past: Daphne Guinness on Alexander McQueen and Isabella Blow Behind the Windows at Barneys". Vogue. Retrieved 10 March 2022.
  23. ^ Harper's Bazaar UK (3 May 2011). "Daphne Guinness' window dressing". Harper's Bazaar UK. Retrieved 12 October 2022.
  24. ^ Watt, Judith (2019). Alexander McQueen: Fashion Visionary. London: Welbeck Publishing Group. ISBN 9781847961013.
  25. ^ Bates, Virginia; Bates, Daisy (2012). Dressed to Kill: Jazz Age Fashion. New York: Rizzoli. ISBN 978-0-8478-3413-6.
  26. ^ Oakley Smith, Mitchell; Kubler, Alison (2013). Art/Fashion in the 21st Century. London: Thames and Hudson. ISBN 9780500239094.
  27. ^ "Fashion Scoops: Blonde Ambition...Birds Of A Feather...Presley Power". No. 69. Women's Wear Daily. 30 September 2004. Retrieved 12 October 2022.
  28. ^ Menkes, Suzy (14 June 2010). "Fashion Report Guinness Buys Blow Collection". The New York Times. Retrieved 11 October 2022.
  29. ^ Horyn, Cathy (27 April 2011). "Now Appearing, Real Daphne". The New York Times. Retrieved 5 October 2022.
  30. ^ Anderson, Christina (9 November 2012). "Daphne Guinness Style Evolution". Huffington Post. Retrieved 16 April 2013.
  31. ^ Donnelly, Erin (26 November 2010). "Naomi Campbell And Daphne Guinness Attend Alexander McQueen's Funeral Wearing His Dramatic Designs". Stylist. Archived from the original on 22 November 2013. Retrieved 16 April 2013.
  32. ^ "Daphne Guinness". Zimbio. 7 June 2012. Retrieved 8 June 2012.
  33. ^ "The International Best-Dressed List Hall of Fame: Women". Style. Vanity Fair. 11 July 2011. Retrieved 8 August 2012.
  34. ^ "Daphne Guinness for M·A·C". Maccosmetics.com. 14 June 2010. Archived from the original on 26 June 2012. Retrieved 8 June 2012.
  35. ^ Daphne Guinness for MAC, Style and Wisdom, 12 December 2011. Accessed 3 May 2012.
  36. ^ Wilson, Eric (24 April 2008). "Daphne Guinness strips down". The New York Times. Retrieved 11 October 2022.
  37. ^ Blasberg, Derek (December 2009). "The Dress That Gets Results". Harper’s Bazaar.
  38. ^ Guinness, Daphne (1 July 2011). "Daphne Guinness on the Unveiling of her Collaboration with Shaun Leane". Vogue. Retrieved 12 October 2022.
  39. ^ Garrahan, Rachel (1 December 2017). "Sotheby's to Auction Jewelry Created for McQueen Catwalks". The New York Times. Retrieved 5 October 2022.
  40. ^ Davis, Dawn Spinner (2 July 2010). "A New Face for Nars: Daphne Guinness". Harper's Bazaar. Retrieved 10 March 2022.
  41. ^ Dunne, Eleanor (22 November 2011). "Daphne Guinness: MAC's Newest Collaborator Knows Her Way Around Drama". Harper's Bazaar. Retrieved 10 March 2022.
  42. ^ "Daphne Guinness Being Fierce in Zoo". 26 November 2010. Retrieved 15 April 2013.